A. Yes, but Gabriel is not a baddy. He becomes insane because he starts to think that if you wrap yourself in God's clothes you can do anything you want, and it ain't true. (Ed. we see who she actually means a bit further down.)There is something insane about a lack of doubt. Doubt, to me anyway, is what makes you human, and without doubt even the righteous lose their grip not only on reality but also on their humanity. The idea that Gabriel takes things into his own hands, decides that the way to get the most souls into heaven is to torch the place, is extremely modern.

Q. How so?

A. In that the attitude of righteousness is a reason for pretty much anything now. What's shocking is how easily that's peddled today. (Ed. And we discover it isn't Islam or its terrorists we have to fear.)It's like Gabriel's rationale. I don't remember the exact lines, but it's essentially, "My job is to get as many souls as possible to heaven, and I have noticed that you are at your most spiritually open when the place is in flames, so I'm going to torch the joint." It's a beautiful piece of reasoning, and it's a righteous argument, but it's terrifying.

Q. Religious absolutism can be found in many places. (Ed. Not a begging question necessarily but watch where Miz Swinton runs with it.)

A. True, there is all sorts of religious extremism (Ed. Yes, indeed but the real culprit for it is where? Wait for it.)all over the place, but the reason for this partly has to do with the fascist attitudes and language of absolutism coming from Washington. (Ed. Yes, of course. I see that now. Bush is responsible for people getting their heads cut off in Iraq and elsewhere because that is what Christianity leads to all over the world.) It's challenging for people outside of America that Bush was re-elected. It means we're all going to have to work a lot harder to understand what so many more Americans than we thought really want. It's an identity shift in our minds about America and maybe for many Americans as well.

Q. And you think this film will resonate along those lines? It's not overtly political.

A. I don't think there is any way that it won't. Actually, there were a couple of moments in my speeches that were more politically on the nose, and they were cut, and I'm actually glad they were. We don't want to date the film, but also we don't want to alienate people who need to do new thinking about this (Ed. See above. The new thinking she wants done is that Americans should stop being religious fanatics who inspire terror everywhere in the world). We're not only preaching to the converted, but we also want to speak to those people who think they know what righteousness is.

Four years ago, Ms. Swinton's career took a turn toward the mainstream. She left her home in the Scottish Highlands, where she lives with her companion, John Byrne, an artist, and their 7-year-old twins. . .